What is Pluck?

Mark and Joni discuss what they wanted to achieve with Pluck

Listen to the audio with the button above and you can read the transcript!

Mark

So, I guess our show originally when we first started the collaboration. It was all very… it's very sensory and very relaxing, just as my nature of the music and by nature of the way the… There's lots you could do with shadow puppets to create a whole other world just behind a single screen. But I guess we really wanted to see how far we could go with it, in a way - not how far we go, but we could really push it and see what is achievable, to keep it nice and sensory, relaxed. But also have things that work for different ages, different… see what sort of stories we can tell. And have that, really, time to actually, really get into what works, what doesn't work.

Joni

Yeah, and especially because we we made sure that sort of built into this project was, we had 10 sessions that are just our regular sessions at Chelsea and Westminster hospital, but to really, sort of, listen to the kids, listen to the patients, get their feedback, you know, get an idea of what they were enjoying, what they weren’t. Whether what we were doing was not age appropriate. And by that I just mean that in you know, it's maybe too, too… for younger children. Making sure that we we didn't forget the adolescents. I think that was a big one. We really wanted to engage the adolescents, because they don’t… Sometimes it's just not as much there as could be for them. You know, we don't want them to be neglected, basically.

Mark

They're also, adolescents tend to be harder to reach. It's a really weird one for them, because they're in a children's ward which often has Disney Princesses all over the wall  and colouring sheets. And they might have, you know, there might be a DVD, it might be computer game, but there's not… but sometimes there's a teen room in some hospital, or a little mini space, but it's almost like it's harder to reach them. And just by nature, the 18 - you know -some teenagers, they're not going to have the same enthusiasm for this sort of thing as a younger child would. I have the same thing with adult wards. Yes, they would like some sort of music, but they're not going to be, as you know - adults don't want to learn how to play a song, and in the same way that children do. Its that - Its that self consciousness about adolescents, I think.

Joni

Yeah. And I think they they've got other things to worry about, like missing out on schoolwork and being with their friends is maybe more important than for, for younger patients as well. So there's more - there's definitely more pressures. So we definitely wanted to make sure that we were engaging with them and finding out more what they what they wanted, like I went with the Youth Worker that was there at the time and spoke to a few patients as well. So we knew that that was quite an important thing to focus on. But I guess a lot of this was just having the time to make things. And I wanted to make 3D puppets, because we - I relied so much from shadow puppetry, because it's quite easy to to create, you know, it doesn't take it, you know, maybe it takes a couple of hours to make a, you know, a detailed Disney Princess, but to make a detailed Disney Princess in 3D was - is weeks, is weeks worth of work. So, yeah, we were, sort of, just interested in what, what the children wanted.

Mark

In our initial - when we first started doing the collaboration, it was seeing what worked really well. And that was, it was about, it was sensory and quite relaxing, but also, and also that for the children, but also for the adults as well. The parents were, ah, this is really - when it's a nice bit of music and there was space, and it's a little space scene. It's nice and relaxing. But it's showing what else we can do with it and where else we can take it. But knowing that, really, that is our, sort of, our main thing is that it's a nice, chilled out experience. And especially in the hospital environment, that's quite important. Because you do get - performers can come in and be a bit more children's party, “Hi, everybody!” But that's not always appropriate for kids who are ill.

Joni

Like, children's waiting rooms and on a, on an afternoon, it can be very hectic. It can be very busy. There can be a lot of frustration. There can be a lot of just, sort of, waiting, which can just sometimes be - that sort of uncertainty of when your name's going to be called up, can be just a little bit, just a bit anxiety inducing, really.

Mark

And they’re often running an hour behind as well. So people can be waiting quite a long time. Not all the time!

Joni

Not all the time! But the - you know, sometimes it is, you know, that they are running behind. And so being able to go into that sort of environment and calm things down, was something that we, sort of, really noticed that we could do. And staff noticed that as well. They were always quite pleased to see us when we came in. So yeah, we, sort of, wanted to focus on our our strengths, but also, sort of, play around with what, what else can we do? What else can we bring? Can we do stories? Can we be more - Because, I think, you know, we barely did, I mean, any talking during, sort of, like our first, I guess, the first phase of what we were doing, where we were just making it up as we went along!

Mark

It was very musical and visual, wasn’t it?

Joni

It was very musical and visual.

So we were just, yeah, interested in, can we do stories or … but also, sort of, exploring, sort of, how many words do you need? Can you have it verbal or non-verbal storytelling? Because it was also trying to make sure that we were accessible, because you do meet a lot of patients who have complex needs, or communicate in different ways, or receive information in different ways, and just making sure that they weren't left out, basically. Because we could do something that was very story driven, lots of narration, lots of talking, but that would exclude some patients.

Mark

We, sort of, got to know various patient needs really. And so it was a big consideration. So, anything that gets created has those needs in mind.

Joni

And I guess a big part of that was being - being again - being really adaptable, being, you know, as much as we were rehearsing and getting to know a certain piece, was also keeping things open for interaction, for however, yeah, however, the patient wanted to engage with it. Because, especially, you know, being in hospital, sometimes any engagement is great engagement, you know? However they want to approach the piece, however they want to, like you said, if they want to watch it from behind, yeah, sure, you know. So it's sort of just taking all of that into account. So, yeah, there was lots that we wanted to explore, basically, and it all just takes time. And we spoke to staff. We, I know I was speaking to patients because I do a separate session, so I was bringing up these conversations while I was spending a little bit more time with with patients as well. So - and we spoke to sort of academic experts as well. So, we're just sort of gathering all of this information, because we knew what we had was really good. We just wanted to see how much more, how much goodness we could get out of it.

Mark

And it was just this idea of, what can we actually create that is our own story and have some ownership of and that's been really rewarding. That's been really good. I think we're now in a position where we've got lots of… lots of things that work really well, and it's all original music, it's all original stories.

Joni

And so, you know, I think sometimes the familiarity of a story, that you know, the Disney Princess is, or the nursery rhymes gave to children was really, was really nice. But I think it's also really exciting to see something completely new, and also something that's quite special to be in in hospital, you know. It’s not something that anyone, for example, at, you know, a child’s school would have been able to see. And to be able to, you know, go, “oh, this happened!” you know, during a - during, you know, an experience that could be really, really tough. I think can, again, give those little positive moments. So, yeah, I think originality was something we were quite keen to do, also, just to sort of see what we could do together.

Mark

It was very much a question. It may have been that we went “Wait a minute, it doesn't work! Just do - kids, they want to see Elsa, that’s it, 'Let It Go’.” But actually, we've had some really good responses. People really engaged. You can - there’s much you can do to create a character visually, you know, the right sound behind it can really, we can bring people along. And, yeah, I think we've developed something pretty exciting. And because it is a hospital centred, we've done it with the hospital space in mind, it is, it specifically works. We're not sort of developing this huge thing that we're gonna have to try and scale down a bit because there's no space. It's made for the hospital, and it's made to be at a bedside where there's not really enough space, so we have to both crouch in a little bit. And that's, that's great, because I think there’s - there's lots of, there's lots of things happening in hospitals, but maybe not loads of things that are devised purely for hospitals.

Joni

Yeah, and it's not having to make compromises or anything like that. It's all this is bespoke. This is for the hospitals, you know, we are - yeah, absolutely, we're creating something that is specifically for the space, specifically for patients, you know. And I think that's really special.